Pinpoint Pain Points - Julien Bertolini

Speaker: 00:00:07

Today's guest on

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MeteoScientific's The Business of LoRaWAN

is Julien Bertolini,

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principal IoT solution

architect at Volvo Group.

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Julien has been instrumental in leveraging

LoRaWAN technology to dramatically

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improve operational efficiency

in Volvo's global factories.

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With a practical approach captured

by his mantra “Think big, start small”,

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he turned simple pilot projects

into extensive, factory wide deployments.

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In our conversation, Julien shares

how he pinpointed operational pain points

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like battery monitoring for autonomous

guided vehicles and developed

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straightforward LoRaWAN solutions

that operators quickly adopted.

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He emphasized the ease

of implementing these solutions,

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allowing factories

to rapidly scale IoT usage.

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Julien also dives into how asset

tracking and enhanced

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logistics are revolutionizing

Volvo's operations, significantly

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advancing their journey

towards industry 4.0.

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Let's dig in.

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Julien,

thanks so much for coming on the show.

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I'm excited to chat with you

today. Hi, Nik, hey I'm pumped.

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So you're at Volvo?

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giant company.

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I would imagine no one listening to

this has not heard of it.

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Let's start at getting LoRaWAN into Volvo.

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Was that a difficult thing?

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How did you convince them to say,

yeah, we'll try this technology.

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The first thing was I convinced them that

we need to test some LPWAN technologies

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just for the autonomy of our IoT,

some IoT sensors.

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And at one point,

when it was, like, 6 or 7 years ago,

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Volvo asked me to choose

what the best LPWAN

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would be for the group,

because they didn't want to

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to spend too much time on different

technologies, too much at once.

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So they wanted really to focus on one

and I selected LoRa

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because I was convinced that,

it was the best solution.

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And, cyber security did a big review

with me, and then I passed the test.

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So after that,

we were able to deploy LoRaWAN.

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Okay.

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And then when you rolled it out,

I think there's a quote in here.

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Something like “Operators

adopted at a 100% from day one.”

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I mean, LoRaWAN

can be a complicated technology.

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How did you make it super easy for them

to say, oh yeah, we're going to use this?

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Yeah.

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So the beginning

where we started with some some POC.

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So I have them a lot locally

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to configure the sensor then.

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And you know to build

all the communication chain.

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So so it was easy for them and

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and then the they were like super happy.

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They wanted to deploy sensors everywhere.

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And well,

that's where I adopted a strategy.

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So, the strategy was to work with,

actually to find a solution provider.

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So, we don't have to monitor

all the gateways.

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They can do it for us.

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And, a lot better than us to deploy

a LoRaWAN network because it's not,

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something obvious.

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And up to that,

we have built a service around that.

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So it mean now it's in the catalog.

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So if a factory that does not have any

LoRaWAN network

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wants to to build one,

they just have to click the button.

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It's an order.

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So they pay for it

and then all the processes is written.

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So we add the new gateways.

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And then on the whole

the communication chain is already built.

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So we are we calling that blueprint.

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So basically that's an architecture

that is validated by our cyber security,

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validated by the enterprise architects

and all that stuff.

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So it just take the usually it's like

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one to three months to have, the network

and all the factories,

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and then they can have sensors,

they can add new sensors and into ours.

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So, that's something that

just super quick and it works at scale.

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So that's something really important

for us. Yeah.

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And you moved it out from a pilot project,

which is where a lot of, I mean, IoT

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projects get stuck,

let alone LoRaWAN, to working at scale.

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I think you've said something like,

think big, but start small.

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Yeah, but that's my favorite mantra.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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What was the first thing

that you started with?

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That was the start. Small piece. Yeah.

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So the first thing was,

some, little devices

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to read the voltage of some AGVs

So AGV is, Automated Guided Vehicle.

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So we have a lot of this kind of animals

in our factories.

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And, when, a battery failure happen,

it has a big consequences.

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So it cost a lot of money.

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So that was the first PoC

that I have done.

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So it was something really simple.

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Just read, read the voltage, send every,

every minutes the voltage to a server

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and check the thresholds,

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if it's below a threshold

just to raise an alert.

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So it was like a super easy

preventive maintenance

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predictive maintenance project.

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So it cost really a little of money

So it was really cheap to do that.

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It brings a lot of value.

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So it was like the low hanging fruit.

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And after that

so we added some all kind of sensors

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like temperature sensor pressure sensors,

different type of sensors in factories.

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And the big the first big deployment, in

LoRaWAN was around trackers

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because we need to track our track

around the factory yard.

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We have a huge factory yards and sometime

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we are struggling to find tracks,

even if it's a big object.

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Yeah, yeah. It's right.

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So the first deployment was 200 trackers.

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So that was the first big deployment

that I have done.

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It worked super well.

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So a lot of factories ask for that.

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And now we have thousands of trackers

that, are working all around the world.

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Yeah.

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And, if I have to, to give some,

some feedback, we have,

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so we have done some tests

with, the public network,

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but we were not satisfied with the LoRaWAN

public network, for several reasons.

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The first being it was not fully reliable.

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So sometimes it does not work.

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And you can not do anything

because, it's not your network.

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And the second thing is

we are working worldwide

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and the network coverage is

not, is not good in, in all countries.

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So that's why we, decided to,

to deploy our private network.

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And I think that

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was a really good decision

because we can monitor gateways,

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we can have redundancy,

we can control and monitor.

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So we are well super reliable.

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I mean it goes like 99.999%.

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Well hopefully there's a lot of nines

at the end of that.

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Yeah. Okay.

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We got to get you on checking out Helium

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because they definitely

have global coverage

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and they're typically pretty good.

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Although I see the

and they're a community network.

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One of the things that happens

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I hear over and over is that, hey,

this thing has to work all the time.

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So I think the, the model

of having your own private network

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and then allowing it to roam on to other

networks is probably a pretty good one.

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So you've got geez,

what seems like kind of a dream job

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for someone in LoRaWAN

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is you've got this big company that says,

hey, you know, go do whatever you want,

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figure this thing out

and help us to go back to that first

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battery monitoring solution for the AGVs,

for the Autonomous Guided Vehicles

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Are these big things that deliver

whatever parts motors around the factory.

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How did you know

that was the right thing to start with?

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Did you do a bunch of interviews

with people?

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Did you walk the floor and say like, hey,

what are your problems?

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How did you figure that out?

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Yeah.

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So, that was my, first year at Volvo

And they asked me

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just to go around factories

and and talk with people.

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And I was talking with, with the

maintenance guy, and I asked the question,

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what is the recurring incident

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that has the most impact

on, on the production?

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And,

the guy was telling me that it happens,

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on average, once a week, that,

we can see a battery failure.

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And for several reasons,

it could have a, a lot of reasons,

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but the statistic was saying once a week.

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So like multiple times a year.

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And I said, wow.

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But it's so easy to solve that.

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That was the beginning of the story. Yes.

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Got it.

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Okay.

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And so folks listening to this

are going to probably look at you

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and say, wow,

this dude's got a lot of experience.

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What can I learn from him?

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One of the first things I'm hearing

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is that you go find the problem to solve,

and then see if you can solve that.

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Is there anything else?

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You've been an IoT biz a long time.

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You've got both the hardware

and software background.

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Is there anything else that you'd

say, like, hey, if you're in LoRaWAN

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and you want to improve your company

or business, whether you're an engineer

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running a company

that you should look at doing

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or things you should pay attention

to that, that people might miss.

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I think one important aspect of LoRaWAN

is cyber security.

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If you follow the,

the state of the art of this, protocol

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and this technology, you can reach

a good level of security, cyber security.

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However,

there are someone else on the market

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doing that actually, quick and dirty.

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I would say.

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So you have to choose the right path

now to be sure

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that, that you have a

good level of cyber security.

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That was

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a key point for me because I knew that

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if I made a mistake with that,

it could, stop the deployment.

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So that's something that,

I really pay attention to.

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Be sure that everything is encrypted.

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Be sure that it's really difficult

to hack any any track down and and.

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Yeah,

to to push wrong data on the network.

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And that was critical from the beginning

okay.

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So that that's that makes a lot of sense

where you can get excited about a thing

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working at long distance and low power

and all the things that LoRa does.

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And you forget to ask like,

hey, am I following the state of the art

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in security

and making sure that the system is secure?

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Yeah, and that was also

what was pushing me to go

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with a solution provider,

because I have enough knowledge to

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to put, LoRa gateways on the Volvo

network.

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However, for each new device,

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each new gateways,

it takes me six months to put that

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on the Volvo network

because of the cyber security process.

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So if I want to do that

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at scale, you know,

it's it's a fast evolving market.

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So we cannot say, okay,

this gateway will work for ten years

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and I will not change this service model.

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So that's why I just push the problem

outside in the cloud

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to a solution provider.

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So now I have just one entry point to

the virtual network from any LoRa devices

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so I can control it, I can monitor it,

and I can be sure that the security

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is in good shape.

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Okay.

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And then it can't be

just you working on IoT at Volvo.

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Can you describe to me

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maybe generally how big the team is

and then how do you guys communicate?

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How are you talking about,

I guess IoT or LoRaWAN?

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More specifically,

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are there tools that you guys use to say,

hey, this is what's going on?

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This is the latest.

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Walk me through kind of what

that what IoT looks like inside Volvo

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as much as you can.

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Yeah.

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So, at Volvo we are a quite small team.

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It's like 20 people.

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And we are an international team.

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So, talking with all,

all factories all around the world.

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However, we have a lot of communication

with the business and the factory.

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And, what I have done is build

what I call a IoT community

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with something like 300 people,

300 members coming from maintenance,

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quality, production, logistics,

anyone that could be curious, around that

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so I can, channel news and also,

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big part of my work

is to explain what one factory has done

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so it can be inspiring for

for the other ones who got it.

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And can you give me a kind of an easy

win there on the factory side,

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outside of the battery level monitor

where you talked about

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one thing that a factory had done

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and then the other 16 factories, like,

oh, we're totally doing that.

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What are the easy wins there?

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Something super easy

was temperature sensor.

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All the factories need temperature sensor.

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It could be for the process.

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It could be for the help of,

an industrial equipment.

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Or it could be for people inside,

the factory.

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So for the comfort that every factory did

temperature sensors.

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And if you say it cheap, it's super easy

to, to put in place.

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And I can give you a dashboard

in two minutes.

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So that's super happy with that.

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Okay, so that's, an easy example.

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Yeah. You can use it in a paint booth.

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You can use it wherever.

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Okay.

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And I guess you could probably use the

humidity stuff in a paint booth as well.

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Let's see.

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So the next question is what's next.

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So you've got this mantra of think

big, start small.

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What are you starting small on

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now that you think

could really expand and help Volvo?

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So yeah, we can see that

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we can solve a lot of issues

with LoRaWAN around internal logistics.

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And that's that's something

that is becoming bigger and bigger.

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And when I'm talking about, internal

logistics is basically tracking assets.

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So assets, it could be anything

from a packaging inside the factory.

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It could be a little part

could be kit because we are building kit

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before going to the to the assembly line,

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and everything

should come at the right time

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and be at the right place

at the right time.

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So in order to, to improve our, process,

improve our quality,

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improve our internal logistics,

we need to track all these things

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and what we have seen is by

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putting some cheap, really tags

on, on all assets

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and having few lora gateway

that are turning the tags,

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we can do some zoning,

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you know, some automatic inventory

at different point of interest.

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And it's really cheap.

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The gateways or them

or the channels could be autonomous.

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So you don't need any electricity.

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You need nothing.

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So the installation is is really easy.

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So cheap, easy to install

and it will bring a lot of value.

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So, that's something that is,

becoming more and more popular,

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but so interesting and help

me understand it so that I'm imagining

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these things are like

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a little rack wireless

kind of sticker tags, like pretty small.

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But are they transmitting on LoRaWAN?

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Which is what I'm assuming.

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Or is

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are they coming from BLE to something else

and then kind of making another hop?

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How does it work?

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So you put some, little BLE tags

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on, any assets that you want to track?

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This BLE tag is just sending an ID,

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every every seconds. Yep.

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In BLE.

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And at some point of interest,

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we put this BLE scanners

that are listening to the BLE tags

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and sending in LoRaWAN

the IDs of these trackers.

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So we do, like, automatic inventory

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every few minutes

and it brings a lot of value, believe me.

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Yeah.

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Oh, yeah, I think that's

I mean, just on the consumer side,

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we see with Amazon how much people love

tracking their packages.

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You know where it doesn't really matter

if it gets here at two in the afternoon

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or six.

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I can see for an industrial process

that might be really important to say

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where you got something off track. Okay.

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Super cool.

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Is there anything else

in the world of Volvo and IoT

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that you're working on

that you're excited about,

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that you think people should know

or learn from?

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Logistics is my main, topic currently.

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Sure.

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So I'll talk about internal logistics, but

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we are working

also a lot on, external logistics.

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Be able to track anything, anywhere

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from all supplier,

but also between between the factories.

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And that's something

that will really revolutionize

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the new way up to doing manufacturing.

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I mean, is really moving the

the Volvo Group together industry 4.0.

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Right on. Super exciting stuff.

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Well Julien,

thanks so much for taking the time.

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I know you're super busy over to Volvo.

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I appreciate you coming on and sharing a

little bit of your LoRaWAN wisdom with us.

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Thank you. Thank you. Nik

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That's it for

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this episode of The Business of LoRaWAN.

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I built this for you.

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The one person in about 100,000

who actually has an interest

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in how this tiny little slice of the world

works.

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Of course, this isn't just about you

and me, it's about everyone in law.

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When and how we can work together

to make an exceptional thing.

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LoRaWAN is a dispersed community

with little pockets of knowledge

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all around the world,

and most of them don't

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talk to each other as much as I'd like.

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So the first and best thing

we can do to make this show better

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: 00:16:43

is to get more guests

on who I don't even know exist.

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: 00:16:46

I want to talk to strangers. Strangers?

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: 00:16:49

Who are your friends.

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: 00:16:50

Please

introduce me to the most rad LoRaWANeer

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: 00:16:53

you know or point to my way, or hell,

reach out and give me a name when it comes

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: 00:16:57

to running down LoRaWAN guests,

I can track a falcon on a cloudy day.

331

: 00:17:01

If you can remember MetSci.show

you can find me

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: 00:17:04

that's M-E-T-S-C-I dot

333

: 00:17:08

S-H-O-W, Metsci.show

334

: 00:17:11

Okay, so sharing knowledge

by getting great guests on is the first

335

: 00:17:15

and by far the most important thing

we can do to make this better.

336

: 00:17:18

The next best thing for the show to do

is the usual stuff.

337

: 00:17:21

Subscribe to the show. Give it a review.

338

: 00:17:23

Share it in your corner of the world.

339

: 00:17:25

Again, that's metsci.show.

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: 00:17:28

Finally, if you want to support the show

financially, you can do that over

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: 00:17:31

at support.metsci.show You'll see options

there for one time donations.

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: 00:17:36

If you really like this show,

as well as an ongoing subscription option.

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: 00:17:39

If you think the show is worth supporting

for the long term.

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: 00:17:42

If you want to try LoRaWAN for yourself,

sign up for a meteoscientific account

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: 00:17:46

at console.meteoscientific.com and

get your first 400 data credits for free.

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: 00:17:51

That's enough to run a sensor for

about a year if you're firing every hour.

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: 00:17:55

The show is supported by a grant

from the Helium Foundation

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: 00:17:57

and produced by Gristle King, Inc..

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: 00:17:59

I'm Nik Hawks.

I'll see you on the next show.