Getting More Data Out Of The Machines - Miroslav Macko

Speaker: 00:00:07

Today's guest on MeteoScientific's,

The Business of LoRaWAN

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is Miroslav Macko,

the CEO and founder of Heliotics,

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a pioneering IoT solutions company

based in Slovakia.

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Miroslav brings an extensive background

in lean manufacturing and IoT,

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uniquely combining these two disciplines

to optimize

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industrial processes

using LoRaWAN technology.

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Miroslav studied

lean management in the Czech Republic

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and spent several years deeply

embedded in manufacturing industries

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such as automotive and medical equipment

production.

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His hands on experience

with process optimization

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led him to realize the transformative

potential of real time data collection,

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something LoRaWAN technology

makes possible in an unprecedentedly

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simple and cost effective way.

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Under his leadership, Heliotics

has executed innovative IoT projects,

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including a Smart City initiative

at Trencin's historic Vodnik Fountain,

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achieving remarkable results,

reducing water use by 75%.

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Miroslav approach emphasizes

simplicity and practicality,

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capturing exactly

the data needed to drive meaningful

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business improvements

without overwhelming complexity.

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His project spanned energy monitoring,

environmental sensing, and operational

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efficiencies that have saved businesses

significant cost and labor.

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In addition to his operational leadership,

Miroslav

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is actively involved with the Helium IoT

working Group,

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bringing a crucial business perspective

to the community driven network.

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Join us as Miroslav shares

valuable insights from his lean management

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perspective.

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Practical use cases of LoRaWAN and advice

for leveraging simplicity

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to achieve exceptional results in IoT.

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Let's dig in.

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Miroslav, thanks so much

for coming on the show, man.

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Thanks for having me. Happy to be here.

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Yeah, I'm really excited.

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You and I have a little bit of history

in LoRaWAN.

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When we met, back when I was doing

the European stuff for Helium.

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Super cool that you were tracking,

I think.

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Cats in the wild, Lynx

in the wild back then.

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And I think the business was still pretty

new, maybe just a couple of years old.

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And you got a couple more years on it.

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Now let's start

with the lean manufacturing side.

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I know you've got this background

in really kind of the business

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side of what's going on,

and you're applying that to LoRaWAN.

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Can you talk me through how

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what you might be doing

is a little bit different

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than someone who comes in it

from an engineering perspective?

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Yeah.

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So I studied lead management

in the university now in Czech Republic.

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And since then I was

I was working in old, like,

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before I joined Heliotics

or said “Heliotics”,

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I was working in various, industries,

mostly in the manufacturing

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roles, such as production manager

or manufacturing manager.

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So I was trying to get all kinds of data

and trying to optimize

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and this was, let's say, like

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first thing, which, which got my attention

that, there are

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there is LoRaWAN

and I can use all kinds of sensors

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to get real time data

and to use this data to optimize,

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because for now

and we still see it with our customers.

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They're using all these paper

form documents and they are

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they're standing somewhere

and they're they're checking the process.

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So in the end like what

what our team is doing.

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So we are trying to state to the LoRaWAN

sensors how to how to help the

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the customers to achieve all these kind

of cost efficiency improvements.

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And you've got a bunch

of different projects, most of them all

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butcher that the name is on.

We can start with this.

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Was it the Modric Fountain project

where you saved?

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I think it was 75% savings in water

and optimizing energy consumption.

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Talk me through how you got that.

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Was that just like a casual conversation

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where someone said, hey,

we need help with this fountain?

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Was that something you pursued?

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How did you get that project?

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Actually,

I think because our office in the city

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where we installed this kind of feature

or use case,

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and we've been asked by the city itself

that if we can do, do something like that.

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So we got a little bit thoughts

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and we came out with this,

with this solution.

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And actually it was like for us,

what was some kind of like pilot project,

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like we are really not into,

like deeply into smart cities,

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but this was something which we can even

replicate in, in industrial companies

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or agricultural companies,

because the logic is the same.

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And we are using weather station

and the controller LoRaWAN

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controller down there, like on the ground

where even there is no cellular

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and there's like logic to it.

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So when there is windy, so,

so it stops the fountain and the software

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is some kind of robot

and and can handle all this kind of task.

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And after one year of using it.

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So we came up with the discussion

with the city.

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And there was 75% of, of savings in total.

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That seems pretty good.

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Yeah, definitely. Right on.

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And then what else are you doing it.

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Electricity monitoring. Vibration dust

monitoring.

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Yeah.

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So in general we can do almost everything.

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And you know that

LoRaWAN is really powerful.

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And there's like plenty of sensors.

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And many of them

we we didn't even hear about.

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But we have our own analytics

plug and play platform

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where we can onboard any kind of sensors

on any kind of LPA network.

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In, in general, what we are bringing

to our customers, mostly industrial ones,

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so they can start directly

without knowing anything

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about IoT to collect data,

all kinds of data.

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Every time when we come to the customer.

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So I like industrial companies.

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So there is some kind of barrier because

they never heard about this technology.

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And the the best icebreaker

for us is right now the energy monitoring.

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So this is let's say

like one of the most common

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use case we do because it's a non battery.

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It's without wiring seat.

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You don't need to do any electrical

revisions and it works seamlessly.

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And after that it's some kind of like

snowball effect to this company.

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Because once they start using the platform

they somehow realize

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the power of LoRaWAN and slowly.

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And that's how it goes.

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Got I hear this over and over, Miroslav,

and it will come to

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no surprises you that one of the,

the standard kind of business practices is

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you have your leader product

that you come in with, and you know

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that you're not going to make

$1 billion on energy monitoring.

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You know one thing,

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but you're just showing the customer how

you're delivering value from the get go.

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And then the customers are like,

oh, can you do this or can you do that?

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You're always like, yeah,

as a matter of fact, I can. Yeah.

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It's one thing that I'm saying

is that since we like of our team,

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we came from

the manufacturing environment.

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So let's say when we are

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going somewhere to, to send customer

or talking to some customer.

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So we,

we like from our expertise experience

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we already know like

what kind of machines are there.

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How how's the process working?

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I was working many years in automotive,

especially injection molding processes

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and even electrical

or medical medical industry.

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So we have some kind of idea

like what kind of use cases

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they will be working for them,

and they will bring them like the,

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the best, the best advantage.

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But the energy monitoring, it's

the it's the biggest use case right now

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even in the Europe

since the energy costs are rising

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and everybody start looking to

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to get more data out of the machines

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and add the thing is that automotive,

it's somehow struggling.

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So they are even looking

for another cost optimizations.

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And you know,

they need to follow their KPIs

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and they need to look

for all these improvements.

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Got it.

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And you're dealing with customers

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that don't need to be persuaded

that data is important.

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They just didn't know

how easy it was to collect.

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And my understanding that. Right.

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Or do you have a tough time, like

explaining to people how they could use

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data? Yeah.

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If I compare between vehicles, like CDs

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and, and like in to standard

industrial companies.

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So we need the serial companies

like they just talk because they,

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they are data driven. They are

they are cost driven.

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They, they are looking

for all this kind of optimization.

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I think it's getting better

like year by year.

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And, you know, I'm

I would lead lean management

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and even manufacturing management

like for a long time.

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So so I see that like data

where always important.

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But right now what we are

giving them, it's

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to have a simple way how to achieve

and how to get all this

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data or let's say all arts or anything

which is relevant for them.

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Okay, so I guess the next question

I've got is because you've got this

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background in lean manufacturing,

is there anything from that

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where you could give someone else

in the LoRaWAN industry some advice,

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maybe an engineer

who's more kind of geeked out on

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how to get some piece of hardware to work,

and they want to start a company,

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they've got a company

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and you're like, oh man, I see

these guys do this every time.

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This is well known

in the lean manufacturing world,

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and they just forget it.

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But if they did it,

their business would be better.

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Is there anything that you can think of

like that? Any advice?

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What I've seen in IoT space, it's

that many time, you know, and a lean, lean

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management

is about doing things simple, but

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like they will bring like many,

many great things.

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And this is, this is also our,

our approach.

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You know, like you can have IoT platform

with dancing monkeys in it, but in the end

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the customer will not use it.

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So so it needs to be like really simple,

but it needs to get all the data

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they're looking for.

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And I honestly, I would say

LoRaWAN is a perfect example

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of how to do things leading because even

the installation is really lean,

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you know,

like the total cost of ownership.

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So you don't have to invest a lot.

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And once you understand

and it's really simple to understand

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when you have the proper tools

and this is what we what we give, then

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we have connectivity where we run our own

network server, we have our own platform.

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And once they start using our platform

so they can even buy

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the sensors themselves and they can

onboard pretty easily by themselves.

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So this is what we we call it like a home

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kit for, for industrial companies

like like India.

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But at device do things simple.

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You know it

it doesn't have to be really complicated.

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Got it now did you come into Helium

six through Helium first?

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Did you see Helium and say,

I'm going to start this?

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Had you already been doing it?

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Walk me through that piece because you're

now on the IoT working group at Helium.

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You and I have a shared history.

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Yeah. How do you find it?

How do how to use it?

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Yeah, like,

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definitely Helium was some kind of, like,

first thing it got me to LoRaWAN that I.

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That I somehow started to think about it

like how to use this technology.

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And after some time,

we started to use Helium.

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Right now we use like various networks,

like if the if it gets to be private,

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is it private?

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But somehow we are still relying with

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some use cases on the Helium

or in some particular cases on Helium.

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So yeah, Gilliam got me to to IoT

and LoRaWAN.

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Like, definitely.

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I mean, it's the same for me.

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Is is Helium got me into LoRaWAN.

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What I'm finding

when I talk to some guests

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is that some of them have never

heard of it, and they think that

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whatever, you know, the various

the various things, you think like

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a community network won't work

or it's not going to be reliable

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or I'm not going to get sla's

which which you're not going to get.

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What have you found?

Has it been pretty unreliable?

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Has it been something where you thought

like, oh, this is a cool backup,

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or is it more like, yeah,

we can use this as a primary network.

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What are your

what are your findings there?

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So far, we didn't have any kind

of troubles or problems with it.

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What we did also back then when we use

like like for, for some of the use cases,

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we even like added extra gateways

which we around on the Helium.

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So somehow to to secure the connectivity.

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But it's, it's pretty good backup.

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I mean let's say you have secretary

which is finding private private LoRaWAN,

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but, our own network server already

because we are running our own.

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Net ID, so it directly when, let's say the

the electricity in the factory

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will shut down.

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So the gateways are off,

but we can rely on the, on the Helium,

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Helium coverage from, from outside

like in this particular cases.

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So it's definitely good

to have for some cases as a, as a backup.

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And in many cases we use it as a

as a standard LoRaWAN.

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Nice.

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Super cool.

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And then you're on the IoT working group.

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I guess the full disclosure there

is that the IoT

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working group

provided the grant to start this podcast,

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although I don't think you were on it

at the time.

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I think you joined it right after that.

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What are you excited to see there?

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I mean, it's

Helium is a community network.

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It's got crypto in it,

which scares a lot of people off.

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It didn't didn't scare you off.

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Why did you join that?

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And what do you think

you want to do on the working group?

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Like speaking honestly,

I think the networking group is missing

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some kind of business element to it

because in the end, everything is business

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and it doesn't have to be everything

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about all the technological

and really hard stuff like coding stuff.

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And it needs to have also this kind

of like

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marketing business and,

you know, like value to it.

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So this was some kind of my expectation

to, to,

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to bring like a different perspective

on some of the things there will

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be there will be sold there.

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Yeah.

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You you've done a good job so far.

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I know some of the the grantees are like,

oh man, this guy's busting their balls

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a little bit.

But it's like, as you said, it's business.

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And I'm just glad you weren't there

when I was.

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When I was coming through,

because I got one of the first ones and

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I think it slid through a little easier.

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I don't know, I'm always looking at it

like from the business perspective.

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So it's like if I am to invest something,

so it needs to rely.

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Everything needs to be,

you know, spic and span.

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That's how we were given.

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So everything needs to be aligned.

Love it.

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Let's see. Let's talk.

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Whatever you can tell me numbers

wise on Project sizes, whether that's

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however your cover comfortably are dollar

amounts, number of sensors, number

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of deployments, number of gateways.

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Like just give me some numbers about

kind of the your business about Heliotics.

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Yeah.

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So like when we are talking about

sensor wise.

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So we are running over 20,000 sensors

already on our network server.

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Not wow.

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Not every sensor is connected

with the things we also sell it

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as a network server.

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But our use cases

are not only industrial long,

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but we have, let's say one project,

even though it's lower

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government entity running

waste management, international parks.

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We also do water meters

or submitting in apartment buildings

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we do with our partners.

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But let's say our

our main focus is the industrial wise.

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This is somehow like, what do we want

to continue because we as a startup

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and we are still startup,

so we don't have like

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really unlimited resources

just to go and just to pursue this.

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Even we have tools for that.

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But this is better to talk

with, with the real companies.

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And they understand

the need for data pretty much.

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Well, yeah. Yeah, that makes sense.

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Is there a use case?

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It sounds like it's energy monitoring,

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but that you think of as one of

the most profitable that you guys pursue,

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where when you see this

come up, you're like,

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oh yeah, I can close this

all day, every day.

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Just because the numbers always work,

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the numbers always work

with, with the energy monitoring.

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I can give you an example.

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Many companies, you know, they have one

electricity meter for a whole factory.

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And once we start deploying the,

the sensors, like, machine by machine.

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So it comes to the situation,

that even bigger machine, which the

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the people thought it will have bigger

consumption, has smaller consumption

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when producing some power.

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So which is completely changing

the understanding.

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And you can even do different price

calculation.

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It can be,

let's say more competitive or even,

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you know, the companies are working with,

higher and lower rates

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for energy monitoring.

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So they can even think about it. Okay.

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Which,

which project to run during the night,

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which project to run during the,

during the morning.

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There's the first thing.

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Another thing is

that we have projects inside factories

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where we measure the dust particles,

which can pretty much lower the,

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the scrap rate,

because you are using wireless sensors

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in various locations,

and you can find out that the,

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air particles are coming up, and they are

they are harming the product in the end.

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: 00:16:17

So you can stop the production.

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: 00:16:19

You can you can fix all these things

which are doing that.

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: 00:16:23

And in the end,

you don't have to produce like really

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: 00:16:26

big Bibles, products like batch

so so stupid much more sooner.

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: 00:16:32

And we are even combining that one

with the door sensors.

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: 00:16:35

So it's like how how long were these

doors open?

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: 00:16:37

How often the

how did they affect, the dust particles.

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: 00:16:42

So this kind of the use cases

are like really great for companies,

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: 00:16:47

because they

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: 00:16:48

can get

alerted when something is happening.

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: 00:16:51

And, since we work like,

mainly with the industrial ones.

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: 00:16:55

So even our alerting

system is already somehow

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: 00:16:59

working with, like detailed description

of what to do.

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: 00:17:04

So, so even let's say

for many got the data, the message.

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: 00:17:08

So they directly know

like they have all the soap inside

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: 00:17:11

and they know what to do.

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: 00:17:13

So these are let's say to really nice

nice use cases.

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: 00:17:17

Another one

which can and we have customer.

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: 00:17:21

And that the labor labor saving

was like up to 25% like like for fun.

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: 00:17:27

And it's about all cycle inventory

check ups.

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: 00:17:31

And like people were running around

like the factory like like counting

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: 00:17:34

how much material we have there,

how much material we have there.

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: 00:17:38

And you just need, you know,

like couple of really smart sensors

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: 00:17:43

or scale sensors and, in the end,

you have like,

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: 00:17:47

pretty 24 seven overview

about the consumption of the material.

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: 00:17:51

And you can even

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: 00:17:53

that will be like next time we want to

connect with the material handlers.

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: 00:17:57

So they they will come.

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: 00:17:59

They will they will bring.

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: 00:18:00

So it will be some kind of electronic or

even carbon to it or something like that.

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: 00:18:06

Oh that's rad.

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: 00:18:07

That's super cool to see you basically

just peeling back the curtain on more

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: 00:18:11

and more data streams about a business

or a business can do a better, better job.

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: 00:18:15

And using LoRaWAN to do that because it's

cheap and easy enough to do it.

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: 00:18:18

Yeah, it's it's cheap.

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: 00:18:19

And the installation of gateways,

you know, like

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: 00:18:22

many, many companies,

they try to like a hell of a money.

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: 00:18:26

It's it is their think.

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: 00:18:28

But we know like how that, could be said

and on the other hand,

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: 00:18:33

like LoRaWAN in the industrial

environment is a perfect, perfect case.

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: 00:18:37

Perfect thing because Wi-Fi doesn't work,

you know, like cabling.

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: 00:18:42

Like, we have company right now working.

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: 00:18:45

And they were installing thermal meters,

and they were running like,

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: 00:18:48

kilometers of cables, you know, like

just to install one, one thermal meter.

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: 00:18:53

And right now, you know, like the debut

of all this kind of installation

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: 00:18:58

is changing.

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: 00:18:58

And LoRaWAN works

perfectly in this kind of environment.

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: 00:19:02

It can go even into the machine

where you have vibration sensor.

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: 00:19:06

So these kind of things, they stand out.

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: 00:19:09

I mean, we do LoRaWAN.

368

: 00:19:11

That's it's rad to see it.

369

: 00:19:12

And then for folks who want to learn more

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: 00:19:14

about what you're doing,

where can they find Heliotics sticks?

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: 00:19:16

We are almost everywhere we can be.

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: 00:19:18

And then we have time for.

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: 00:19:20

But definitely we are.

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: 00:19:21

We are sharing some posts on our web page,

even like on the LinkedIn or Twitter.

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: 00:19:27

So just you can just go to Elliot x.com

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: 00:19:30

and you will find pretty much everything

there.

377

: 00:19:34

And it's not just just right.

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: 00:19:36

Right.

379

: 00:19:36

And let's, let's, let's do some business

together.

380

: 00:19:40

Love it.

381

: 00:19:41

Love it dude I love how you hustle.

382

: 00:19:42

Always good to spend time with the love.

Thank you so much for making time.

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: 00:19:45

I think early morning your your late

evening starts. Thanks.

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: 00:19:47

Come on man

thank you. Have a great day. Bye bye.

385

: 00:19:52

That's it for

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: 00:19:53

this episode of The Business of LoRaWAN.

387

: 00:19:56

I built this for you.

388

: 00:19:57

The one person in about 100,000

who actually has an interest

389

: 00:20:00

in how this tiny little slice of the world

works.

390

: 00:20:03

Of course,

this isn't just about you and me.

391

: 00:20:05

It's about everyone in LoRaWAN

392

: 00:20:06

and how we can work together

to make an exceptional thing.

393

: 00:20:09

LoRaWAN is a dispersed community

with little pockets of knowledge

394

: 00:20:12

all around the world,

and most of them don't

395

: 00:20:14

talk to each other as much as I'd like.

396

: 00:20:15

So the first and best thing

we can do to make this show better

397

: 00:20:19

is to get more guests

on who I don't even know exist.

398

: 00:20:23

I want to talk to strangers. Strangers?

399

: 00:20:25

Who are your friends?

400

: 00:20:26

Please introduce me to the most

rad LoRaWAN you know, or point to my way.

401

: 00:20:31

Or help reach out and give me a name

when it comes to running down

402

: 00:20:34

LoRaWAN guests,

I can track a falcon on a cloudy day.

403

: 00:20:37

If you can remember net sweet show,

you can find me

404

: 00:20:41

that's met ISI

405

: 00:20:44

dot show net psycho.

406

: 00:20:48

Okay, so sharing knowledge

by getting great guests on is the first,

407

: 00:20:51

and by far the most important thing

we can do to make this better.

408

: 00:20:54

The next best thing for the show to do

is the usual stuff.

409

: 00:20:58

Subscribe to the show. Give it a review.

410

: 00:21:00

Share it in your corner of the world.

411

: 00:21:01

Again, that's Matt Sideshow.

412

: 00:21:04

Finally, if you want to support the show

413

: 00:21:06

financially, you can do that

over at support Dot Net Sideshow.

414

: 00:21:10

You'll see options there

for one time donations.

415

: 00:21:12

If you really like this show,

as well as an ongoing subscription option.

416

: 00:21:15

If you think the show is worth supporting

for the long term.

417

: 00:21:18

If you want to try LoRaWAN for yourself,

sign up for a scientific account

418

: 00:21:22

at console Dot Meadow Scientific com and

get your first 400 data credits for free.

419

: 00:21:27

That's enough to run a sensor for

about a year if you're firing every hour.

420

: 00:21:31

The show is supported by a grant

from the Helium Foundation and produced by

421

: 00:21:35

Crystal King, Inc..

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: 00:21:36

I'm Nick Cox.

I'll see you in the next show.